d_aulnoy: (Default)
d_aulnoy ([personal profile] d_aulnoy) wrote2006-05-23 12:46 pm

(no subject)

Last night I found a cowrie shell wedged tightly into a sidewalk crack, just before I had yet another fight about feminism with my best friend.

I used to post about feminism a lot on this journal.  Over the course of the last couple of months I've stopped, though.  Not because I've stopped thinking about feminism, mind you - but because I've spent so much time talking about it, and fighting about it, that writing my thoughts out has become peculiarly exhausting.  It reminds me of how my writer friends say that they never discuss stories before they're finished; it sucks the spirit right out of them when the time comes to put pen to paper.  

This last week, my life has been a) talking and fighting about feminism, and b) writing a paper about witches as inadvertant role models in their roles as testers.

Witches are, generally speaking, not positive figures in fairy tales.  When they're positive figures, we call them fairy godmothers, or white enchantresses, or sorceresses.  "Witch" means villain.  "Witch" means,  kind of selfish.  "Witch" means, disrupting the social order.

But "witch" can also mean helper or tester.  "Witch" can also mean inadvertant role model.

The witch in a fairy tale has always been a fascinating figure to me when she's a recurring character, because, hey, picture being Baba Yaga.  You're out there in your forest with this neverending stream of children and heroes coming to your door, asking for the foal of the Mare of the North Wind, or advice on how to get to the sea that houses the salmon who ate the rabbit who holds the heart of Koschei the Deathless between his teeth, or just for a way to relight the fire that a wicked stepmother put out.  And, once in a while, you get a little frustrated and you bite someone's head off, and all of a sudden everybody's calling you wicked.

It feels a lot like being a feminist, frankly.

Because I get so damned tired of having to be the one to explain that, actually, women do not take being catcalled as a compliment, even if it would be a godsend for a guy.  I get so damned tired of being called oversensitive or humorless because I don't just see the joke, but also the social context that allows for the joke, which, when you think about it, isn't all that funny.  I get tired of being an apologist for my movement, because, hey, while I might not agree with every little tiny bit of feminist thought out there, I think that the basic cause is still worth identifying with, and fighting for.

I get so damned tired, and I've only been doing this for a little while, comparatively speaking. 

But I'm writing a paper about witches, and I found a cowrie shell wedged into a crack on the sidewalk, and it is still worth it.  

I've never set up a girlie filter before, because, well, I don't tend to have all that many barriers, but I think I'm going to set one up for feminism.  You wanna visit me in my little hut in the forest to hear me rant about feminism, comment below.

[identity profile] prosewitch.livejournal.com 2006-05-24 12:50 am (UTC)(link)
I would love to read your thoughts on feminism--I adore reading what you have to say as it is, and I especially enjoy anything to do with feminism. Goodness knows I feel like a crazy feminist in many of my classes as it is.

Oh, and I'd also be interested in reading your witch paper if you ever would like to send it my way. In return, I'll be happy to send you my fairy godmother paper, which I need to revise to send to Marvels & Tales in August because they've accepted and reviewed it... :)

[identity profile] d-aulnoy.livejournal.com 2006-05-24 01:01 am (UTC)(link)
Oh, CONGRATULATIONS, that rocks!

And this sounds like an excellent trade to me. :)

sign me up too

[identity profile] thekathysmom.livejournal.com 2006-05-24 01:32 am (UTC)(link)
Having had years of experience, marriage and sons I might have a different perspective.

(Anonymous) 2006-05-24 01:37 am (UTC)(link)
I'll ping for entry to the hut when I sort out an LJ account (which may be a while at the rate I'm going -- too far behind at work to come home and fight with another computer). In the meantime, I'll make like like an oldphart (masculine of crone?) and say I'm glad people are still willing to stand up; I've been periodically wondering ever since the actress playing Susan Silverman (in Spenser for Hire said that she'd toned down the character since we were in the "post-feminist eighties". (Maybe she had an excuse, being the female in a show cast with male eye-candy rather than realistic types, but I was dumbfounded.)

/CHip

[identity profile] handworn.livejournal.com 2006-05-24 01:40 am (UTC)(link)
Hmm. I want to take neither side. Guys who catcall or whatever are obnoxious and no one I want representing my gender. On the other hand, I've encountered a large number of activists, of whom feminists are a subset, who are in fact oversensitive and humorless.

[identity profile] copperwise.livejournal.com 2006-05-24 01:44 am (UTC)(link)
You know I'm there.

I'm a witch, and not necessarily in the pagan sense. But if life is a fairy tale, I'm the witch. In many of the ways that they appear in the tales, she is me.

[identity profile] d-aulnoy.livejournal.com 2006-05-24 02:05 am (UTC)(link)
Well, Sturgeon's Law, right?

But ... just to clarify, mind - off the filter, then?

[identity profile] justinelavaworm.livejournal.com 2006-05-24 03:54 am (UTC)(link)
Yes, please!

[identity profile] swan-tower.livejournal.com 2006-05-24 04:26 am (UTC)(link)
I like the idea and name of a Baba Yaga filter. :-)

(Anonymous) 2006-05-24 05:52 am (UTC)(link)
I had an argument with my brother today. Can I just say - I am so tired of explaining why pedofilia is wrong.

Obviously I'm not implying that my brother is a creep. Hell no. Just completely disconnected statements. No connection there. No siree. Shame on you for connecting them.

[identity profile] d-aulnoy.livejournal.com 2006-05-24 06:19 am (UTC)(link)
Thank you for illustrating WHY I'M SETTING UP A FILTER.

Also, to continue the bad analogy thing: had the same discussion with a thousand other non-creeps? Congratufuckinglations.

[identity profile] handworn.livejournal.com 2006-05-24 01:33 pm (UTC)(link)
I haven't had much luck, flame-wise, arguing in favor of my left-leaning moderate viewpoint with either feminists or fundamentalists. So unless you think you'd value that POV in a discussion of these things, I guess, yes, off the filter.

Also read Jirel of Joiry

[identity profile] idiotgrrl.livejournal.com 2006-05-24 01:51 pm (UTC)(link)
Back in 1981 I was writing an article on C.L. Moore for a book (long oop) called "The Feminine Eye" and came to the same conclusion about one of Jirel of Joiry's adventures. She ends up in the underworld confronting a wicked sorceress. The entire process seemed more like an initiation to me and I said so in the article.

I couldn't ask Ms. Moore about it, even though she was the guest of honor at Denvention, the first Worldcon I ever went to. She was starting to fail at the time, and it would take a pushier person than me with more status to have even gotten close. However, your atricle brought it back.
lindsaybits: (soap bubble)

*waves hi*

[personal profile] lindsaybits 2006-05-24 02:00 pm (UTC)(link)
Ahoy hoy! I found you through the lovely and talented [livejournal.com profile] erzebet, who linked to this post. So that's where i came from, iffen you were wondering.

[identity profile] vschanoes.livejournal.com 2006-05-24 02:05 pm (UTC)(link)
You know what, circehellene? I think it's a fine analogy, and reveals more about your anonymous annoyer than he realizes--pedophilia is wrong and foul. (If I were going to split hairs about it, I'd say that acting on pedophilia is wrong, feeling it is merely unfortunate and rather gross.) And so is anti-feminism.

But more to the point, as you've pointed out before, yet again this person is completely missing the point, which is that the world, and your desire for conversation, does not revolve around him or his gender. Guys would like being catcalled? Who fucking cares? Feminism is not about exploring men's experiences of their sexist behavior--that's called, oh, the fucking norm for the past couple thousand years. Feminism is about putting women's experiences at the center of the discussion. And, by the way, how nice for men, that their experience can be completely hypothetical on so many levels: they do not, by and large, get catcalled, so they can imagine the experience as being complimentary and under their control (only the comments they'd like from the people they'd like); they are not, by and large, several inches shorter and many pounds lighter than the people doing the catcalling, to say nothing of being socialized to avoid fights and confrontation (obviously you're not, CH, but generally our gender is); men are not continually being stalked, harassed, and raped by women, so again, they don't have to worry about that threat. Well, how nice for them. That's male privilege in action right there. And I'm not so sure that in reality they would take it as a compliment--remember those gay-bashing men who try to use the "gay panic" defense to justify beating up and sometimes killing gay men who had the temerity to express their admiration of these men and desire to fuck them? What about all the legitimate, regular ways of paying somebody a compliment? Somehow "Hey, chicky-mama, shake that ass," comes more often than "Excuse me, ma'am? I just wanted to say that you look lovely." And yet, which is more likely to be taken as a compliment?

And this conversation breaks down along similar lines: you write up a post about your experiences feeling drained about having to continually explain and re-explain basics of women's experiences and feminist consciousness, how it relates to your work, and how it makes you feel, and you get the man in question popping up and saying "You're making me look like an asshole." Well, guess what? This conversation is not about you, guy. Also, you, CH, have said almost nothing about the guy in question--you've said that he's a friend, and you've listed the conversations that have made you "tired." Unless you're actually making these conversations up and they never took place, in which case, how could the anonymous friend decide that you're referring to him, he's saying that a simple statement of facts makes him look like an asshole.

Feminism is not about women catering to men's ignorance and privilege ("I'd love it if a bunch of strange, repulsive men twice my size told me to suck their dicks or talked about my boobs--it would be a compliment! It certainly wouldn't remind me of the time my little sister got felt up on the subway, or the several times strange men showed me their penises and/or masturbated in front of me, or the time some guy tried to follow me home, or the times my mother was sexually harrassed, or the time my grandmother was sexually assaulted, or the many friends of mine who've been raped, because, hey, those things never happen to me, so I don't have to think about them and can assume they don't happen to anyone! How nice for me.") It's not about women showing exquisite care and tact in order to make sure that members of the dominant group, men, don't feel bad. It's about putting women's experiences at the center of any discussion about the issue, and analyzing those experiences politically, that is to say, with respect to the differences in power between men and women. And that should make men uncomfortable.

[identity profile] vschanoes.livejournal.com 2006-05-24 02:13 pm (UTC)(link)
Yeah, I know. They can pry my tampons out of my cold, dead...well, perhaps I won't go there.

[identity profile] d-aulnoy.livejournal.com 2006-05-24 03:50 pm (UTC)(link)
Cool - no offense taken, and none given, I hope.

Re: sign me up too

[identity profile] freddiemac.livejournal.com 2006-05-24 05:41 pm (UTC)(link)
well, when you consider that your experience/perspective was able to turn me into someone that circehellene could put up with for the last 13 months, i imagine your contributions will make for some wonderful reading...

...ok, i admit, i can't wait to see some interesting stories about dad... :)

freddie mac

Re: sign me up too

[identity profile] thekathysmom.livejournal.com 2006-05-25 02:07 am (UTC)(link)
They will be forthcoming :):):):)

[identity profile] thekathysmom.livejournal.com 2006-05-25 01:02 pm (UTC)(link)
I have been reading this for a couple of days and this ones seems to have the idea most closely stated. It is all about power. Just as the voting laws of the deep south were. That kind of male must feel powerful, or his identity is threatened. Giving women power somehow threatens these men.

[identity profile] handworn.livejournal.com 2006-05-25 01:43 pm (UTC)(link)
Nope. Some other time when I have more time & energy, maybe I'll join in the discussion.

[identity profile] verbify.livejournal.com 2006-05-25 02:27 pm (UTC)(link)
*shy*

Hi.

I've been lurking for about a month, ever since we had a lovely back-and-forth on fem_rage a while back. With your permission, I'd like to add you as a friend and, if you are so inclined, be included in your Hut O' Feminism.

[identity profile] merrymaia.livejournal.com 2006-05-25 06:48 pm (UTC)(link)
Of course!!!

[identity profile] 2muchexposition.livejournal.com 2006-05-26 07:21 am (UTC)(link)
I could put this more eloquently if it was, oh, earlier here, but for the meantime... abso-freakin'-lutely.

please count me in

[identity profile] kengwen.livejournal.com 2006-05-26 05:18 pm (UTC)(link)
I despair sometimes about the feminism. Took an intro to women's studies class a few years back that was titled "Women's Issues" (fortunately the prof, who had taken the class over from someone else, succeeded the next year in getting it retitled, yay), and the first day we were sent out into the halls to ask people what they thought about feminism, who feminists were, etc. Not one person owned up to being a feminist. Most people's free-association went something like: "hairy...lesbians...in the 70s...hate men", but one person who looked legitimately confused and finally said, "someone who doesn't like women?" Good grief, I thought, where are the rest of us? Certainly I'm not the last feminist, even in NH...

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